[00:00:00] Luke Storey: I'm Luke Storey. For the past 22 years, I've been relentlessly committed to my deepest passion, designing the ultimate lifestyle based on the most powerful principles of spirituality, health, psychology. The Life Stylist podcast is a show dedicated to sharing my discoveries and the experts behind them with you. Dr. Lana, welcome to the show.

[00:00:27] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Thank you. Thank you for having me.

[00:00:29] Luke Storey: Yeah. I'm stoked, man. We're finally getting down to this. I remember, you have to help me with the memory of one part of this, because I don't remember how we were introduced, but I remember our first phone conversation.

[00:00:39] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: I do.

[00:00:39] Luke Storey: I was on Beverly Boulevard in Los Angeles, I think near Stanley, right in front of International Silks and Woolens. And I remember pulling the car over, and we were just having a chat, and somehow, the work of Dr. David Hawkins came up, and then Vedic meditation, two things that have really had such a positive impact on my life. And then, we started talking about quantum physics and all this stuff, and I was like, this lady is cool. We got to do an interview, and here we are. That must have been, I don't know.

[00:01:06] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Two years ago, three years ago.

[00:01:07] Luke Storey: Two or three years ago, yeah, but I just have such an aversion to doing remote interviews. I had planned to come to New York City to do some sessions with you and interview you there, and then we all know what happened in New York City. You had to flee. But remind me, how did we first get introduced? Do you remember?

[00:01:25] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: I think it was either through Thom Knoles and his work on Vedic meditation that we kind of chatted about, or there was something else as—oh, you know what? We met first when you were with Sah D'Simone and some other people in New York City. Remember, there was-

[00:02:02] Luke Storey: Oh, we did. We had met in person. That's right.

[00:02:02] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Andrea organized that I forgot a group that was, what was it called?

[00:02:02] Luke Storey: That's where I met Alyson. It was WITMA.

[00:02:02] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: WITMA. That's where I first met you, introduced by Andrea Pratt. And we were there also with some other people, just very beautiful people, Sah D'Simone and some other people.

[00:02:06] Luke Storey: Yeah. And that's the event that which I met Alyson. Yeah.

[00:02:09] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Oh, cool.

[00:02:10] Luke Storey: Yeah. Wow. What a fruitful event that was. That's funny. I forgot we had actually met briefly in person, because I just remember that phone call, and I was like, oh, we're going to get along great.

[00:02:20] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Me, too. I remember the phone call very, very clearly. I was actually at home, and sitting in my home office, and just thinking, in a certain way, you said, oh, we need to do a podcast, and we just kept talking, and talking, and talking. And it was just like one of those things that you know, when you know, you know. It's like, really, we would think the same way.

[00:02:38] Luke Storey: Yeah, absolutely.

[00:02:40] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: There is beautiful connection and really amazing co-productions that can happen.

[00:02:47] Luke Storey: I often have conversations like that, and think, I wish I have my mics with me, because sometimes, like when you very first meet someone, it's that immediate rapport you have, and there's just magic that ensues, and I always think, oh, man, I should have captured this.

[00:02:59] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: That's what you said then.

[00:03:01] Luke Storey: Yeah, but here we are. But here we are.

[00:03:03] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: It's perfect. It always works.

[00:03:04] Luke Storey: And now, what's really cool is I've gotten to experience firsthand what we're going to be talking about today, Think Interfaces. For those listening, I just did a session right before I set all my stuff up, and usually, before I record. I just get a lot of anxiety, because of all the technical stuff, because it kind of puts me in my left brain, and I'm like working equipment, and plugging all the things in, and doing all the things. And then, I've learned to find ways to switch and kind of sync my hemispheres a bit and get more into my creative flow, so I can have empathy in a conversation, but it always takes a lot of work to do so. And I sat down with you, and I'm just like, after that training, I'm just totally dialed in.

[00:03:45] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: It's just bliss together.

[00:03:46] Luke Storey: Yeah, it's amazing. I actually don't even feel like talking, which is funny. So, you're going to do a lot of talking, Lana. Alright. I want to start out with this. What is the most exciting, fulfilling thing going on in your life right now today?

[00:03:59] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Oh, that's wonderful. The thing that when—you just put me on the spot, but I'm going to go from the heart. Yes, as a brain specialist, I can talk about brains, but the best thing about Think actually is think with your heart and feel with your brain. So, I'm going to think with my heart now, and tell you, I think ascension is magical. We're now in this process of ascension, where we all came here to actually elevate humanity and go to the next levels. And I just get shivers when I even think about it, because I know that we all are here to elevate everybody the next 5D and beyond, and co-create this new Earth, which we're all talking.

[00:04:47] So, that's super exciting to me. And that's why, partially, I created the system. And one of the things is that, so that's one of the beautiful things about it, and how it ties, what I do into this fifth-dimensional reality. So, not only does it heal people, especially people who have PTSD and trauma, now, I work with them, I have the honor of working with a lot of people, children and adults, and it goes away. We go into 5D, into bliss, and all the hurt and pain from PTSD goes away. And we can talk about particular time and dropping into particular time in healing the past.

[00:05:29] And it all happens in quantum time, which means rather fast or in no time, a little bit like Lasik. So, it's all quantum field that we love, and it's really beneficial to everything. And we just glow and grow, and that way, we usher millions of people up there to the next level. And the more consciousness we have about it, the better it is. And I think the bliss of having this technology as well and being able to honorably help so many people is such a joy every day.

[00:06:01] And I stay in this 5D place most of the time. It's like funny, but it's where we are. As you can say, we're blissing and it's fine. And it's always like that when you go to the next level. And I think that's very exciting. And another thing that is super exciting is that these new creations that I'm creating, expanding the company, and creating other technologies with some really fabulous people, meeting you and Alyson, maybe even thinking about transferring to this beautiful land here of the free.

[00:06:39] Luke Storey: I'm voting for that. I hope that comes to fruition. I was thinking about it yesterday and I found myself kind of the controlling, getting what I want. So, I was like, I got to find a way to work it out, so Lana can move here. And setting an intention is one thing, but then I also realized, I was like, hey, she's going to end up wherever she's meant to end up, but I'm hoping that, karmically, this is the spot, because there are so many incredibly beautiful and brilliant people here that I just know you would—you've already aligned with quite a few of them.

[00:07:12] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Well, you shared your friendships with me, so I'm so grateful.

[00:07:15] Luke Storey: And there are so many more. And they're just people that are doing great things in the world. And many of them are also influential, and excited about discovering people like you and your work, and helping you get out there. I'm not the only one that does the kind of thing that I do here.

[00:07:29] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: It's just so beautiful.

[00:07:30] Luke Storey: Yeah. But even if you just come visit a lot, we'll be happy to have you.

[00:07:34] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Yeah. I'm looking for, actually, really, at least for six months, and then we'll see what happens. But I definitely resonate with this land and this Lake Travis. It's just magical.

[00:07:48] Luke Storey: Yeah. We got to hit up Mike and see if we can get out on his boat, get on the lake. Yeah, that's super fun.

[00:07:53] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Yes, I've seen him.

[00:07:54] Luke Storey: I mean, you're from Italy, and I have not been to Italy, but I have been once to the Mediterranean, to Mallorca, Spain. And being on Lake Travis reminds me of some parts of Mallorca. I think it's a similar kind of terrain. The water looks similar. There's this arid desert sea kind of topography. Yeah, it kind of reminds me of that sometimes. And it's really-

[00:08:22] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Mike has said the same.

[00:08:23] Luke Storey: Yeah, it's unexpected. I wasn't thinking Texas would have that. I don't know what I thought it would have, but it's kind of nice. You're out on the lake and you're like-

[00:08:29] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Gorgeous land.

[00:08:30] Luke Storey: Yeah, it is.

[00:08:31] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: People are so beautiful, especially those that you introduced me to, but even those few that I met on my own here in the hotel, and it's just beautiful. So, I feel blissed and blessed.

[00:08:43] Luke Storey: It's kind of southern hospitality. I know some people in the Texas don't count it as the South, but when you say y'all, and there's someone who has an accent like this, that's kind of southern to me. But yeah, okay, I digress. Let's get down to it. So, you mentioned this word a lot when I'm hanging out with you and doing the work with you, you'll often guide me in these sort of hypnotic meditations while I'm working with the Think Interface technology, and there's something you just drop in in almost every sentence, and that's this 5D, this fifth-dimensional existence or reality. How would you define that? What does that mean to you?

[00:09:19] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: So, that's a very good question, and I think it's personal to everybody. However, what it really means, the way that I transmit it to friends and people that I work with, is usually getting out of this rigid way of seeing us as finalized being at the level of the skin. You can just be finalized and contained in this cocoon of the skin or whatever we have, but we don't stop here. Our photovoltaic body is expansive. And so, for me, of course, I work with electrophysiology and various frequencies.

[00:10:00] Frequencies are my specialty, so frequency level, you're glowing, you're expanding your leptoquarks or your moons, and your photons, where one big blob of cloud of information, glowing at miles radius. And so, when I say 5D, it's just like a switch from this finite movement or finite feeling of just sensorial feeling into this energy from the heart, where you expand and you bliss at the levels that are vibrational. And that vibration is not only electrophysiological or vibration of the= sinusoidal vibration of the waves. It could be also magnetic, it could be also photovoltaic, and it's just expansive.

[00:10:51] It's like big blob, big cloud of a beautiful golden light. And without just being too woo-woo about it, it's actually what happens at quantum physics level, and we know that. So, you just drop into that just perspective. It's a different perspective. You see yourself as a cloud of information or as vibrational field. And we're used to talking about cloud, iCloud and stuff like that, but we are clouds of information. And I think, I suspect that people from Apple or whoever actually started creating the iCloud has actually understood that long ago, that all energy is actually energy at the level of cloud, at the level of field.

[00:11:41] So, we operate in the field mostly rather than operating in the three-dimensional. We're becoming aware of that, but it has magic in it. And so, it's to bank onto being aware at the 5D, rather than 3D at the magnetic, electromagnetic, or cloud level. For us as cloud of photovoltaic energy and magnetic energy, we then have much more power and much more potency, and the possibilities are endless.

[00:12:08] Luke Storey: I think this is why I like hanging out with you, because you're someone who is highly trained and scientifically validated. You got the stamp of approval, and then some from the scientific community, which we'll get into, but you're also deeply spiritual. And to me, I mean, I guess it goes both ways, but true science is, to me, the same as spirituality. And spirituality is very scientific.

[00:12:38] Now, within those realms, you have a lot of pseudoscience and you have a lot of pseudospirituality, right? There's a lot of falsehood in the human experience in general because of, I guess, our naivete as a species. We just will wander off and follow any shiny thing, myself included, at many times in my life. But I love how you're bridging the gap of these two or rather proving that there is no gap, right?

[00:13:01] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: There is no gap. It's all one. Yeah, but I think Robert Edward Grant is somebody I listen to a lot or I read his books and his writing. He's a good philosopher, and mathematician, and really, a kind of renaissance man. And I think he's talking about that as well and Da Vinci was talking about it. Robert Edward Grant just solved some of the unsolvable problems. I think the 17th of August, he came out with some really discoveries that are incredible using the Da Vinci Code.

[00:13:37] And so, it will be very interesting to see that brilliant man. And so, what happens with this, when you see people like that, he speaks very fluidly between, doesn't have a gap, like what you notice, there is no gap. You just travel. You are here, and we're in 3D, and we're in 5D, or in 12D, whatever, wherever we can get to. Right now, fluidly. So, this fluidity that is developing is stemming from our consciousness. The more we are conscious and in our 3D world, we were taught at school that we need to gain knowledge. That's just my humble opinion. And then, we were gaining knowledge.

[00:14:19] With that knowledge gaining, we can actually expand our consciousness as well in parallel. She said, that part was omitted from the classroom. And that part, personally, I learned through thumb or through other teachers that I've studied Vedic meditation with and other things, Sufism and some other beautiful practices. And we all do, and we combine it, then you play music. When you play music, you go into trance. And it's something very tangible, but very spiritual at the same time. And the strings on the guitar, they're sinusoidal waves when they move, so the kinetic energy produces the sound energy, but we're not thinking about it, we feel with the guitar.

[00:15:05] Luke Storey: Wow, that's cool. I never thought about that, like the mathematics of music, right? I think like I just always played music from feel, because I didn't have the type of mind that could learn to read music or play highly technical music. And I don't think I ever had the discipline to become an aficionado on an instrument that was very technical. And I just like-

[00:15:26] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: But you play guitar and you play it really well.

[00:15:27] Luke Storey: Yeah, I play bass and guitar. Yeah, I just learned the very bare minimum I could learn about music theory in order to just stay in the right key. You know what I mean? Just kind of understand, I remember the guy that taught me my bass at first. He was teaching me some of these just basic pentatonic blues scales that most rock music is based on. And he said, this is called minor, think John Lee Hooker. And I was like, okay, kind of sad, moody.

[00:15:57] And then, you learn a couple of those scales, and they said, this is the major scale. Think Chuck Berry [making sounds] I was like, that pretty much got me through for 15 years. I mean, here I am, being a podcaster and not a paid musician, so maybe there was more to learn, but I had fun just based on the feel of it. But I like how you're saying, if you think of really—I mean, it's true of, I guess, a wind instrument or any stringed instrument, right? It really is just vibration, and we perceive that vibration through space and time as a tone. And that tone has some effect on our emotional and kind of energy body.

[00:16:33] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: We speak through vibration. Our course are vibrating so that it can hit your tympanus and your tympanic membrane, and therefore you can hear. If that was not functional, we would not be able to speak and hear each other. And that's all physics from that. But I think it comes from the heart vibration as well. And I think that most of our language actually comes through first telepathic feeling and is not biomechanical through voice vibration chords, vocal chords vibration, and tympanus membrane vibration. But I think it really comes first from the heart, and from the electromagnetic field and photovoltaic field. We're just starting to understand that.

[00:17:17] Luke Storey: What is this photovoltaic field?

[00:17:19] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Photons like light, and voltage, Volta, Alessandro Volta named the voltage, electricity. So, photovoltaic is a combination of photons and electricity. It's a magical, normal, magical-

[00:17:36] Luke Storey: This is another word that you use a lot, and I've been meaning to ask you, what does that mean? So, now, everyone can learn.

[00:17:41] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Now, you know. Very simple. All the crazy things are the most simple things.

[00:17:46] Luke Storey: I rarely do this, because I'm not so concerned with someone's credentials or how they gained their body of knowledge. I'm more about what the knowledge is, but I am in awe of the level of education that you either subjected yourself to or enjoyed, I guess depending on your experience of it. Seeing someone that quit—I quit high school the day I turned 18. When I was legally not required to go, I was like, and goodbye, and here I am. But in what field of study did you get your PhD? Where did you go to school? For how long? What are some of the things that you've studied? And what are your kind of scientific and academic credentials?

[00:18:27] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Yeah. So, I hail from Europe. So, I lived in Rome most of my life, well, most of my beginning of my life, in Trieste, and also my family is, now, in Croatia. So, I went to schools there, and in England as well, in Cambridge. So, my elementary education was just a classical linguistic gymnasium, very good school, very, very good school, but I studied languages. And I was always interested in ethnomusicology. So, sound, and music, and linguistics, and I studied even Sanskrit, and Ali, and different languages when I was rather young.

[00:19:04] But when I was a very young kid, I knew that something chooses you, you don't choose that. So, I did not choose my path, this vocation chose me. I did not have a choice in a way, just like, it came and I had to do it. And so, I knew when I was very young that I was going to do something in medicine. And when I was about 13, 14, I became obsessed with brains, and I just read like a sponge anything that had to do with brains, and frequency of music, frequency of sound, and languages, very old languages, altered Slavonic [indiscernible] crazy stuff like that. I was never into, whatever, empath or somebody who is sensitive, could never be at large crowds.

[00:19:51] So, I was never really a partygoer. I am very social, but I don't like being in the large concerts, large crowds. But I always was interested in trance music and electrophysiology of the brain, but also, of the body and more of an experience at the whole holistic level. And so, I studied at the musicology as my undergrad, and actually, [indiscernible] for a little while. And then, for three years, just very early on, very fast, and kind of compressed everything very quickly.

[00:20:27] I went to Rome and got a degree in—essentially, I created my trajectory. I asked the professors to give me a possibility of creating. It's a PhD level, but I created my own trajectory when there was no neuroscience courses yet created. So, I just put it together and it was basic theories of medicine, like physics, mathematics, whatever you need to do at a basic first three years of medicine. And then, I piled everything that had to do with brain mapping, electrophysiology, evoked potentials, brain mapping, and dopamine.

[00:21:01] That was the time that nobody was doing that yet. So, very few people were doing that. And so, my professors were kind enough to say yes, and I was able to study a lot of electrophysiology, EEG, brain mapping, evoked potentials were my specialty. These are potentials that you stimulate the eyes or the auditory system, and then you evoke a potential in the synapses. And you get these spikes and you study these brain waves.

[00:21:31] So, that's very kind of specific. And then, I came here, my post-doc at Mount Sinai in New York City, did two years at Mount Sinai studying Parkinson's, dopamine. Dopamine was my big deal, always, and brain mapping at every level. And then, after that, and I was doing it also in Italy intrasurgically as well with electrodes in the brain. But then, after that, here, I just went also for the second round, studying neuropsychology and anything that had to do with non-invasive ways as well.

[00:22:07] And so, this non-invasive part was always appealing to me. And when I opened my private practice, then that was in New York City on the Upper West Side and Upper East Side. I was seeing a lot of children with ADHD. So, from before I was dragging this idea that I wanted to create a better electrode, because brain maps and brain caps were done in a very primitive way with actually a swimming cap with some little electrodes in there and gel. And it's still being used. I'm in shock.

[00:22:38] Luke Storey: I've had a lot of those caps on, and I've got to say, your headset is so much easier. It took you like two seconds to get connectivity. I mean, it's like-

[00:22:45] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: It took us three years to create it, and that little electrode is proprietary of ours that we're not even showing in public yet. It has my own alloy in it, and it's dipped in gold, in pure gold. And it's a smart electrode, so it has chips on it. So, it took us years, three years, a team of many, and I work with Honeybee Robotics, and their specialists, robotics specialists who have aparatti on Mars and Jupiter. I mean, they're really smart people.

[00:23:15] So, as always, whenever you start doing something, you're just one link. I spearheaded all of this and invent it, but a lot of people are part of a team. So, these electrodes are, I think, one of the few people in the world who don't have to use the gel or anything, you just plop it in your head. That's one thing that I wanted in Rome when I was seeing all these Parkinson's patients. They were trembling and moving, and by the time you're done with gel in one part of the head, the other part is dried out.

[00:23:48] Luke Storey: Oh, my God. I never thought about that.

[00:23:50] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: That's a nightmare.

[00:23:51] Luke Storey: Right. Because with the normal qEEG, I mean, you have to be quite still. I've done a lot of neurofeedback and things, and if you're chewing gum or moving around, you get bad information.

[00:24:03] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: This is really good, and you did not see the motion, but we can actually move around and jump once you have it situated properly. It's just really great. It took us quite a while to get to that level. So, that's one thing that I always wanted to do. I swore to myself that one day, I would invent a better electric and a better system, because it was really, really horrible to do all of that, but 10 times a day, it was just really hard and demanding.

[00:24:30] And this other thing is that these children who had heart issues, they cannot take stimulants. And so, the parents, the three sets of parents, asked me if I could invent something to heal the—to make them focus better, and to make them work better at school, and be more present and not running in loops. ADHD can be really demanding. I mean, you can peel the child off the walls, basically, need for hyperactivity is there.

[00:25:01] Luke Storey: That's interesting. So, if a child has heart issues, they can't take something like Ritalin.

[00:25:07] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: No Ritalin, no Adderall. There are so many problems with that.

[00:25:10] Luke Storey: Oh, wow, interesting.

[00:25:12] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: So, I created the game first, and then other games, and then that's how it came out. And we tested, we did a lot of work. I mean, it's been, now, almost 14 years. We got patents on it. I got patents on. I have three patents. And I met all the timeline milestones that we need to meet with my company, create a company, created everything in it that works. And we tested.

[00:25:40] We have long, double-blind, randomized, sham-proof study with a hospital in Barcelona, Columbia University, NYU Langone. We worked with MSK, Mount Sinai. One of the collaborators is Tel Aviv University now, University of Maryland, and Paris, and Sorbonne. So, these are the groups that we work with, and Honeybee Robotics, and some other privates, about other eights groups of engineers that we work with, which is a big team.

[00:26:13] Luke Storey: Well, I want to get into some of the studies, specifically a little later on, because I think some of the clinical work that you've done is super cool and impressive. And I mean, I'm someone that just experiences so many things. To me, a lot of it's anecdotal, but I like when even if I'm having a placebo experience with something, that's valid to me. I'll take a placebo over nothing working, right?

[00:26:39] But I find it really interesting when there's data to back things up, then it helps me kind of buy in to something also, because I'm like, wow, I saw the white papers, I saw the study, or these photographs of some blood cells, or anything, even like the, we were talking about the spinach test with FLFE, and you're like, well, that isn't very scientific. For me, that's scientific enough. It's like I'm made a water, you're putting water on the spinach, this one grows faster than this one, I'm doing that thing, but your studies are obviously much more elaborate than that.

[00:27:12] So, we'll get into that. But teach us a little bit about neurochemistry. I'm so curious about dopamine, and serotonin, and tryptophan. And ultimately, what I'm really interested in is the endogenous DMT or dimethyltryptamine. I mean, is that what it is? Dimethyltryptamine. From Joe Dispenza's work, I mean, his theory is that you have these metabolites of serotonin, and tryptophan, and these things, and if you do certain things, you can kind of exponentiate those higher states of consciousness. So, give us a bit of a breakdown on the neurochemistry, if you would.

[00:27:50] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Yeah. Well, dopamine, according to Harvard School of Thought, is a feel good form hormone. And so, people often get comfortable—well, first, dopamine is a neurotransmitter. We have several neurotransmitters and they transmit. So, here are my hands. I'm Italian.

[00:28:08] Luke Storey: People watching at home can see the Italian hands.

[00:28:10] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Definitely. So, the synaptic cleft is between the two synapses, and you have one neuron, and so dendritic ends, and there, you have this little end of the synapse on one hand and the other one here. And so, how do they talk to each other? They transmit. They send little balls of transmission of serotonin, or dopamine, or whatever the transmitter is. And then, these receptors receive it, and then they transmit the impulse all the way out. And the transmitter, the impulse goes along the axon.

[00:28:44] Luke Storey: That's so funny. I never thought about neurotransmitters actually transmitting information. That's funny.

[00:28:51] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Yeah. It's all in the language, isn't it? Language is magical. Words can be powerful. So, dopamine actually enables you to respond to reward. So, that he had done, when you get the heart on your Instagram or something, you get the dopamine pump. And fortunately and unfortunately, it can be used in both sides. It can be used in a negative way or in a positive way. If you reward certain things that are really good, for example, in our case, you're rewarding specific opening of the pathways and specific frequency in the brain that you elicit, then you reward that many times, then you help create certain specific pathways that is linked to dopaminergic transmission.

[00:29:38] And believe it or not, dopamine, many people don't know this, is a lot of many, many receptors for dopamine are situated in the retina area in the eye. And so, when you stimulate the light, or light, or very various frequencies, where there is spatial frequencies or visual frequencies, they come into your eye, into your retina or fovea. And so, through for foveal vision or parafoveal vision, you end up stimulating the eye and stimulating the retina.

[00:30:09] And they're very—in that level, we get the impulse. But impulse gets better or worse if you have all the dopaminergic receptors in place that are working really well. And then, they coordinate, honestly, I think it's through—this is our way of stimulating, through dopaminergic, through visual field. So, you can stimulate dopamine in many different ways through loving your dog, you hug your dog, oxytocin, dopamine flows. But again, that part of dopamine transmission, that part of reward is very instantaneous.

[00:30:49] So, it's kind of a momentary strong joy, strong jolt of joy, whereas serotonin is usually associated with long-term happiness, consistency in that well-being of not having a depression, for example. If you have equalized dopamine and serotonin, you will not have a depression. You will have an equalized mood, and your mood will be elevated, and your serotonin is responsible for longitudinal well-being, mental well-being. So, it's more related to happiness and consistency over time, rather than an immediate jolt of joy and almost ecstasy.

[00:31:41] Luke Storey: Got it. I wonder if, evolutionarily, we have that visual stimulation of dopamine, because of our need to look for food and procreation. Do you think that has something to do with it?

[00:31:57] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: I question that. That's a beautiful question. You know why? Because also, when you communicate with somebody, and people say, the eyes are the seat of the soul, I always believed that. And I think it's because it's connected to this photovoltaic feeling, photovoltaic being, and to our heart energy, too. It's like it flows. When you're in the flow, you're literally in the flow of dopamine, and it's elevating. And if you have sunshine, if you have good light, you rarely are sad, but go to the places like Sweden or Norway, where there is no light, you have to create your artificial light to not get the seasonal depressive disorder.

[00:32:41] Luke Storey: Right. I even have a light at home that's—I mean, mostly, I have a bunch of red lights, because I'm trying to get rid of the blue light at night, but I do have—it's called a Vera Lux, and it's for seasonal-

[00:32:52] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: I have it, too.

[00:32:52] Luke Storey: You do? It's amazing. I use it when I travel to kind of change my circadian rhythm. So, if I'm in some weird time zone, I'll like wake up in the morning and look right at that thing and pretend like it's the sun. It really works.

[00:33:04] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: It does work. That's why it works.

[00:33:06] Luke Storey: It's like a full spectrum blue light, basically.

[00:33:07] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Correct, because you're stimulating your dopaminergic receptors in your retina.

[00:33:11] Luke Storey: Oh, I don't even know what I'm doing.

[00:33:14] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: No, but you go by the heart and feeling.

[00:33:15] Luke Storey: Well, just fundamentally, it makes sense, right?

[00:33:17] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Yeah.

[00:33:17] Luke Storey: Because I'm tricking my brain into a different time zone, that we've not evolved to change time zones that quickly, obviously, so, yeah, kind of use that. But that's really interesting.

[00:33:26] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: But it's beautiful, isn't it? Because actually, you get visual reward and visual associations for like food, or our loved ones, or our children, or our dogs, or our partners. You connect with people through eyes and I think, also, through heart energy. I think our heart energy, like literally heart field, has been underestimated. And I love the Gregg Braden is studying it very nicely and I fully believe in his science.

[00:33:55] Luke Storey: The Heart Math Institute, all the work they're doing.

[00:33:58] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: But there are others. I mean, we're studying it very scientifically and at the level of self, through kind of proven randomized studies of double-blind studies and all of that, and it shows. So, one of my favorite things about is, maybe it's freaky, but it's interesting. So, some kids need heart transplant, so there was this one girl, and this is a true story, one girl had a heart transplant, and suddenly, she started developing nightmares.

[00:34:29] She's like a six-year-old girl. And nobody could understand why, because she was very calm usually. But she had a heart transplant and she got the transplanted heart from somebody else, another six-year-old, from another part of the country. I don't think they usually tell you about it. And she developed this nightmares, and then she worked with some psychiatrists and specialists, at the end, with forensic specialists, because the parents really were curious about it and wanted to stop these nightmares.

[00:34:58] And so, the specialists designed, I mean, she was showing with her nightmares, where there were recurring nightmares of being in the forest, and actually, her life was taken away. And she was frightened. And she described this man to a tee, like literally. So, this forensic artist was able to create from the memory of this girl, from these nightmares of this girl, he was able to create the image of this event.

[00:35:34] Somebody got a good idea, one of the sheriffs got a good idea to actually try to figure out if there was some correlation with something that really happened. Lo and behold, it did. They found which area of America, it was somewhere in the Midwest. There was a murder. And the murder was happening, and that was the murder of that girl whose heart was gotten. And they tracked the perpetrator and they caught him.

[00:36:00] Luke Storey: What?

[00:36:02] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Now, this like gives me shivers, that it's crazy, but this is where we know that the heart has memory. In the heart, we have electrophysiological field and this is a forensic medical fact. It's beautiful story, but it tells you that heart has a memory. It has a cluster of neurons that is called neurites. And it's really like a brain of the heart in the heart, and then in the brain, we have the center that governs also, that is correlated with the heart. So, these are not just sci-fi stories, they're electrophysiological data. Not my studies, but I find it fascinating.

[00:36:41] Luke Storey: That's so fascinating. I've been thinking about PTSD lately, because I know we're going to talk about that more, and I want to get back into the chemistry side of it, too, because I know there's so many nuggets in there to unpack. But I've been thinking about this with people that have childhood trauma or early life trauma, and how that manifests as PTSD. When you look at what's going on in the world now, I mean, you just have so many traumatized people running around, myself included, and almost everyone I know is recovering from that.

[00:37:13] And when I've been contextualizing that in terms of relationships, like romantic partnerships, because it's something I had such difficulty with. And through a lot of the healing that I've done, I've been able to really overcome most of that and have a great relationship, as you know, you've been experiencing it. And I was thinking about how it relates to the heart, and that when we're harmed, whether physically, or emotionally, or psychologically, it breaks our heart. 

[00:37:45] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Mm-hmm. Literally.

[00:37:46] Luke Storey: Yeah. And that then we enter into adolescence and adulthood, and we attempt to have relationships with a heart that's still broken. And I think we often think of the broken heart as like a breakup, right? The demise of a romantic relationship about which we were hopeful, and enjoying it, and ended for whatever reason. But I think it's that heartbreak piece that is what's driving so many of us and trying to enter into any kind of an intimate relationship with your heart's still broken with that unhealed trauma, is like trying to get up and ski again with a broken leg.

[00:38:21] You got to heal the leg, you got to put a cast on it. And so, there are many casts for the heart, but it brings me to that realization, something I've been exploring a bit lately of how so much—we think of our heart as this thing that just pushes the blood around, but as an energetic field of our heart, and that it can be harmed, and I guess I'm using the word broken for lack of a better term, but it can be harmed in ways that inhibit our ability to function in fulfilling and healthy way.

[00:38:57] But because it's hidden and it's not a broken leg or a broken arm, where it's visible or it's acutely painful, it's just kind of this chronic aching that many of us carry in our lives. And we look outside of ourselves to try to find the remedy in all the things that we think are going to remove that sense of dis-ease. So, anyway, there's not really a question in that, but it's just something that I like to speak to, because it's something that's helped me so much to just identify. 

[00:39:24] And this is where we live. We live in our heart. I mean, we think we live in our mind, but we're really generating our energetic field from the heart. And if there's a disturbance there, we're going to also attract other people, right? We're going to find vibrational alignment with other broken hearts, and get into that trauma bonding and all that. It's fascinating stuff. So, to hear it scientifically validated is meaningful.

[00:39:50] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Oh, man. So many things that you raised now that I'm like-

[00:39:54] Luke Storey: Feel free to spin off, we're not on a linear journey here.

[00:39:59] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: No, but this is actually all connected, because what you're saying, this vibrational of the heart and the broken heart is actually leading me to think about all the talks and all the knowledge I learned through science of photovoltaic or voltaic field energetic. So, essentially, think of yourself or a human being as a battery. So, when you think of aura, or a field, auric field around you, it's basically a battery field.

[00:40:33] So, there are several doctors who are studying now the correlation between what happens when you have a surgery in your mouth or teeth, that you have cavities, and you have been filled with mercury or something like that. Not only does it go into your system, but it disrupts your, actually, battery. The center part of the battery, which is right here in our heart. And that's why heart and mouth, heart and teeth are connected. So, you can't have like a root canal, it's better to avoid the root canal, because there are studies showing that there is a correlation between then disruption of the rhythm of the heart. And because if you look at it from electrophysiological point of view, this battery field gets disrupted.

[00:41:20] So, literally, you have a clunky battery here, so you don't emit anymore this synchronized, uniform, beautifully in sync, literally in sinusoidal sync. You don't feel that anymore, because there has been a disruption. And what happens at the level of amygdala, for example, when you have a trauma, and there are so many things that I want to say about it, I'll try to be linear about it if I can. When you have a trauma, let's say you talked about broken leg, but also, equally or even more powerfully is like we say broken heart or broken trust when somebody hurts you, or physically hurts you, or emotionally hurts you, there is an injury inside your cells for the memory.

[00:42:14] So, hippocampal area, you end up with a fight or flight reflex immediately. Let's say it's the same type of thing that you feel if you feel a breakup trauma from a lover's breakup. And we have studies on that, don't mind, but other people studies, equally painful and equally disruptive in the circuits of the brain, as if you had a trauma to a leg, like equally and similar pathways, actually.

[00:42:47] Luke Storey: So, it's kind of like an emotional TBI. 

[00:42:49] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: An emotional injury. It's literally an injury. What happens when you have this trauma, you end up feeling a loss, like a complete loss, something shrivels and dies off. And literally, some of the cells actually go into apoptosis. So, you have the cell death. So, you have circuits that actually start installing themselves that are the wrong circuits. So, you have this obsessive thinking about memories of what had happened before, which is somebody really hurt you, really, really hit you hard.

[00:43:21] And so, in that moment, your amygdala flared up. You started firing from amygdaloid cells. And those amygdaloid cells are the startle cells. They provoke the startle reflex, which is great, important, wonderful self-defense mechanism if you are touching fire for a moment, because you're not going to get burned. But if you start having that all the time, goes into this loop that then doesn't stop. It develops almost like similar to OCD loop or similar to a broken CD. You have a group.

[00:43:56] Luke Storey: I'm very familiar with the phenomenon you described.

[00:43:58] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Me, too. I mean, I don't think we've not-

[00:44:00] Luke Storey: I mean, not so much anymore. It's rare, but that-

[00:44:03] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Oh, me, too, because what happens is that when you're hurt repeatedly, you try to repair the hurt, and you go into maybe, oh, maybe I'll repair it. The brain thinks maybe I'll repair it through rehashing it and fixing it somehow. What did I do wrong? What did I go wrong? And those circuits install themselves and you can actually—so Dr. Schwartz at Columbia Presbyterian, he'd wrote about it in a book by Norman Doidge, the brain that heals itself.

[00:44:33] You can actually look at—he works with OCD patients, where he says, turn the page, you interrupt the circuit in a certain specific area, in actually prefrontal area of the brain, which is also linked to dopaminergic pathways. But what happens when you have this trauma, something installs, its firing starts from amygdala, and then the memory starts connecting, the loop starts connecting all the way down to hippocampal area, pass through thalamus as well.

[00:45:02] So, it's our emotional center, and it goes and installs itself into disrupting dopaminergic circles. So, the dopamine circles start being not properly activated. Serotonin circle started being deactivated again, so we have the serotonin drops, so you have this sadness. And this sadness starts developing maybe depression. First, we start with the scary moments of amygdaloid overflow, and then you end up with, basically, you go into hyperdrive for a moment, and that stays with you for about three days, five days, 10 days.

[00:45:40] When you go into this adrenaline hyper drive, it's really, literally depleting your dopamine and serotonin. And so, dopamine, it creates the flows of dopamine that are inadequate, they can even create motric problems. They can create motric problems of like language. So, your buccolabial, your expression starts, people start stuttering. It's all connected. And with OCD cycle, serotonin drop creates then possibilities for OCD cycle.

[00:46:14] So, it's all connected, but people tend not to study altogether. You go to a psychiatrist and they'll give you Xanax for calming you down for one part, instead of understanding it holistically as a big symphony of the brain and big symphony of your experience, which then if you go into quantum field, you can understand at deeper levels, and you can then repair the photovoltaic area, the voltage, and you have to start from somewhere. So, personally, I think we start from electrophysiology and stimulation of the—we use the frequencies of your own brain non-invasively and we stimulate the retina, so you can actually reinstall the equalization.

[00:46:59] You stimulate the dopamine so the dopamine pumps equally, stimulates nervous vagus, everything gets equalized, and then serotonin comes in, and norepinephrine and noradrenaline actually calm down. So, everything kind of goes into perfect symphony of calm and bliss, but you can approach it from different ways as well. You can approach it through, as you go with breath work and you can go into access, you can go into Kundalini breathwork, which is what Joe Dispenza does, teaches. It's all old, 7,000 years old work from Himalayas.

[00:47:36] Luke Storey: I remembered what Joe Dispenza told me about that, just to digress for a second, because we were talking about this yesterday, I said, Joe, I love your work, and I benefit a lot from the meditations and things. And I said, and when I started doing it, I realized, this is what I've been doing in Kundalini yoga classes and teacher training stuff for a number of years.

[00:47:57] And I was kind of waiting for his response if he was like, no, I invented this, and he was just like, well, yeah, duh. And he said something to the effect, he's like, Luke, your average person is not going to go do Kundalini yoga or some of these more esoteric practices, so what I'm doing is just taking these ancient practices and giving them to the masses in a way that's generalized enough so that it's not threatening to their belief systems or their culture.

[00:48:22] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Brilliant marketing strategy. Absolutely.

[00:48:23] Luke Storey: So, that was his answer, because I couldn't remember the answer the other day, and I was like, alright, that's fair.

[00:48:28] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: It's fair. I mean, whatever makes people feel better, however you can deliver it. My point was just to say that we can approach the healing from many different aspects, but this trauma has been documented to be, you ask me to break it down a little bit. Hopefully, I didn't jumble it too much.

[00:48:48] Luke Storey: No, keep going. It's brilliant.

[00:48:50] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: This amydaloid reflex, or fight or flight is good if your house is on fire and you have to get out of there very quickly, but it's not good if it continues forever, because it depletes everything. It's excruciating. We all have been in trauma. And what's interesting to me is that I think it's useful for people to know that, really, it's documented medically that it's in circuits of the brain. It manifests almost the same as a broken leg, so it's literally a broken heart, it's a broken circuitry of the heart circuitry, of the electrophysiological voltage, which then can propel the heart.

[00:49:32] And all these disbalances in the brain can propel the heart into a heartache, what they call heartache, but essentially, it impacts on rhythmicity or heart rate. And heart rate has to be kind of regulated in a way that it's not always the same. We have kind of intermittent heart rates and we know all of this whole separate field. I'm not a cardiologist, but I know that there is a synchronization between the brain and the heart.

[00:50:01] Luke Storey: And most people listening will be familiar with HRV, heart rate variability, right? So, when your nervous system is balanced, sympathetic and parasympathetic, you're going to have a higher HRV score.

[00:50:12] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Exactly. And it does impact our oxygen transmission then. It impacts our mitochondrial growth. It impacts at many genetic level or epigenetic level. So, we see that all of this is connected. So, what am I trying to drive at or where my heart drive is in is that it's all connected. And it's then better, I think, more efficiently repaired and more efficiently understood if you understand quantum field, because at quantum levels, you can actually heal a lot faster in exponential ways and effortlessly.

[00:50:54] Luke Storey: Well, that's definitely been the case, for those listening, you already know this, but when Lana showed up in town, I've been having a good life, you know what I mean? Being here the past few months, there's a lot going on, but the week before you showed up, things had really hit a fever pitch with my stress level. I mean, just too much to handle, because of some situations going on in life that needed to be adjusted, and I'm in the process of adjusting them. But when you showed up, I was in that limbic system lock for like two days before you gave me your-

[00:51:30] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Amygdaloid overflow.

[00:51:31] Luke Storey: Yeah. And it's like no amount of meditation, none of my devices, praying my ass off, doing the breathwork. I mean, like the other day, I passed out, straight hit my face on the floor doing breath work. That's how hard I was trying to like get out of it. I was trying to get out of this feeling. I'm just like, I can't function. And I used to live like that all the time. That's the good news. I mean, my whole life as a drug addict was that, and even for many years after I was able to get sober, because I was just so injured. But when I came over, and I've done three Think Interface sessions now, and within the first day, it was totally fixed.

[00:52:13] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Isn't it great?

[00:52:14] Luke Storey: Yeah. I mean, it's just insane. And not just a temporary thing, where like I felt good for an hour afterward. I was like, okay, I'm back to myself, I can breathe again. It was just like, oh, there was so much more distance between me and these perceived challenges that I've built up in my head. So, I think there's a lot to talk about there, but what I want to know is when it comes to that fight or flight, when we've had our heart broken or whether there's been some emotional or psychological damage to our brain and all of this connectivity in this delicate symbiosis that exists between all of these systems, it's so interesting how in a human, we really lack the ability to reset it on our own.

[00:52:58] But when you look at the animal kingdom, I'm thinking of a deer, there are so many deer around here, and you'll be driving around, and you might startle a deer, driving close to them or something, right? And they freak out, and they run, and they jump over the fence, and they're in a fight or flight. They're flighting, right? They're fleeing. And then, they just stop kind of look around, and they go back to eating, and they're just totally relaxed, or you see a couple of ducks, and they have a little tussle, and [making sounds] and then they just shake the water off, and then it's just like nothing ever happened, right? And I just marvel at the ability for animals to have an appropriate stress response that then subsides when the threat is no longer present.

[00:53:36] But with us, there's this mechanism of action that you described, where there was a real threat, we were harmed in whatever way, car accident, getting beaten up, whatever. But that thread is literally gone, but then something comes into our direct experience that subconsciously even reminds us of that threat, and then the same response happens even though it's illogical and makes no sense. We're actually totally safe. Everything's fine. All our friends tell us, dude, what's wrong? Why are you tripping? It's all good. It's going to work out. This is no big deal, And you can't make it stop.

[00:54:09] And it's torture. And I think for a lot of drug addicts and alcoholics, because I've known so many and continue to have so many friends that have escaped that demise, many of us live that way for a very long time, and many people never, ever recover from that. And I guess that, in a blanket sense, could be called PTSD. I mean, it's an actual disorder. So, I guess there are two questions kind of in there. One is, is it the complexity of the human mind that gives us the propensity and the vulnerability for that dilemma over animals? And then I guess maybe explain your definition of PTSD and the different flavors of it. 

[00:54:57] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: It's a very interesting question, whether it's a complexity of human mind.

[00:55:04] Luke Storey: Why can't I be like a deer, and like something jumps out in front of me, and I freak out, and I run, and then I just go off and eat something, and forget about it.

[00:55:13] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Because you're an incredibly divine consciousness being. And I think our conscience plays a big role. That's just my humble opinion.

[00:55:22] Luke Storey: Is it the prefrontal cortex that has developed in us and not in other primates and animals?

[00:55:27] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: I think it has to do with our evolutionary capacity as thinking beings. I think it comes into the loops of thinking and memories, it ingrains in our hippocampal areas and our memory is much stronger than it would in animal memories. And I think our emotional link, thalamic link with the memory, with the hippocampal links, the thalamus and the hippocampus are involved together with our memories, long-term memories and short-term memories, then flare up in this amygdala, which is a gland as well. 

[00:56:05] And that area, it discerns us, it doesn't stop discerning. And then, we install these new groups, which animals tend not to, although elephants remember really well, and I wonder whether it has to do with certain aspects of their brain. But I wouldn't stop, again, just at the brain physiological level, I would think it has to do with us as beings, actually, who have come to this planet, to this Earth, as spiritual beings.

[00:56:38] And I think it has to do more with our evolution and our evolving to the next level, where we can actually feel that degree that we have to recognize. So, the reason that you snap out of this loop with quantum tool is because you enabled yourself as a sentient, fifth-dimensional being to go into that state of mind, where you can be in the now, because what you were experiencing is for like 45 minutes, you're being in the now.

[00:57:15] There was no way that you could actually accept being in the now. You have to lift that ramp and you had to move certain things on the screen. And if you did not do that, you would not be working. So, engage your whole being in being in the now. And with consciousness and this divinity crisis consciousness that we all hope for, we hope to attain to some level of enlightenment, and I don't know whether animals are enlightened or not by themselves already, I would suspect yes.

[00:57:47] Luke Storey: Some of them seem to have it pretty well-figured out.

[00:57:49] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Pretty high level of spirituality at every level. But I think that for us, and this is just my humble opinion, I don't know, really. But at that level, I would say, most likely, we're almost designed to experience these experiences so deeply, almost the level of torture or to the level of torture, to then test ourselves how to find this God particle within us, how to go—maybe animals have that all the time, but we as humans, it's almost like our rails have closed when we came in, Plato talks about it, and we ended up living in this mire, this illusion. 

[00:58:36] But once we pierced this veil, which many people are saying now, this veil has been lifted quite a while now, almost six months now, and we're actually experiencing other realities and other capacities that we have, and actually, I believe that every human being, every brain doesn't stop at the brain, we stop at this photovoltaic and other sphere of, we're light beings, just simply because we are photons in movement. We're clouds of information. And once we step into that powerful field of divinity consciousness, we then invite our knowledge, our experience of God within us, of our higher self, whatever you want to call it.

[00:59:23] You can use any verbiage about it, but it's always the same thing, is this blissful capacity to stay in the center of this toroidal field of photonic energy that we know that everything is possible. And then, at that place, there is no fear. There is no fear in 5D, there is no fear. And when you get to that point where you actually are fearless literally, like the Zen Masters or like the karate masters, like the samurais, they got to the point where they have no fear.

[01:00:00] And when you get to that point, and I think we can all get to that point where there is no fear, all of that that was fed by the narrative over this three-dimensional world that we're in just goes away in no time, no space. And we're just in a bliss all the time, because we realize there is no fear, that can go away. So, if we could create, we're free to create, and beautifully.

[01:00:26] Luke Storey: So, in a sense then, this capacity that we have to become injured, the sensitivity we have is perhaps part of the intelligent design of our Ascension platform. So, we have this more broad spectrum capacity for the evolution of consciousness, and within that, there are some pitfalls, because you have the spectrum, right? You can go from the lowest level of apathy, and grief, and despair to the highest levels of celestial ecstasy, right? We have all of that kind of at our fingertips.

[01:01:06] And so, that gives us the karmic kind of toolkit or opportunity then to have some grist for the mill to work with, whereas a deer is just kind of like, wow, where's the water and grass, I got to make a baby and go make some pebbles. What do they call them? They're not called pebbles. I think they're like—I'm thinking of deer turds, droppings, droppings, that sort of thing, deer droppings, yeah. I mean, it's a simplistic existence, and they're just kind of holding their place in the ecosystem, but who knows? One can hypothesize that they don't have the same spectrum or capacity for conscious evolution that we do.

[01:01:46] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Maybe they don't need it, maybe they are not—I think we came here to experience ourselves and experience certain experiences, be it great, wonderfully amazing, winning, whatever, experiencing the bliss at the top of the mountain when you climb, or anything like that, or suffering. That's also an experience. It's a very valuable experience. But when you hit the rock bottom, it's interesting how many—especially people who are now very awake are those of us who have actually hit the rock bottom. It's almost like Phoenix comes from the ashes. We have to redo it. But we hit that rock bottom. I mean, we all hit that rock bottom, and we don't do it.

[01:02:30] Luke Storey: I call it my rock bottom, and not to try to be special, but it was a subterranean rock bottom, it's like below the bottom. One of my teachers used to say, I said, man, I went lower than whale shit, and that's at the bottom of the ocean.

[01:02:48] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Yours must have been lower than that.

[01:02:49] Luke Storey: Yeah.

[01:02:49] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: So, you are special.

[01:02:51] Luke Storey: Yeah. Well, I think within our capacity for suffering also is born out of that is our capacity for empathy and compassion, right? I mean, when I see people suffer, I mean, I'm just driven with their permission, and invite, of course, to do anything I can to alleviate that, because it's not some foreign experience to me. I see it, and I go, oh, God, I remember what that feels like. And so, that's the healthy part of the brain that can take me back and not go into some spiritual bypass, where I've totally negated the suffering that I've experienced.

[01:03:23] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: But I have enough access to it, hopefully, to go, ah, yeah, let's stay humble, right? Remember where I came from. Remember how blessed and fortunate I am to have evaded harm in the ways that I have. And then, hopefully, be driven to assist other people in doing the same. So, thank you. Thank you for contextualizing that, because there are times when you're in the thick of it, where I go, sometimes, it's just, God, being a human sucks, like it's so hard, sometimes, for all of us. And of course, many people in the world right now are having that experience even more so than I-

[01:03:56] But it's linked to a narrative, isn't it? I mean, what comes to mind is that we tell ourselves this is so hard, because the world around us here told us it's so hard. But when you go to India, I have never been yet, but when you look at India, and some people, you would just say, they're suffering so much, they're living on the street. And yet, my friends who went to Himalayas or to India, they said they are not suffering.

[01:04:28] Luke Storey: I've never met happier people anywhere in my life than in India, especially in the remote villages that a Westerner would call like poverty-stricken, right?

[01:04:38] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: And they're blissing.

[01:04:39] Luke Storey: Yeah, they're living the dream. They're super happy.

[01:04:42] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Right. So, that's my point. It's all a narrative. It's all what we tell ourselves or people tell us. And if you tell people from the very young age that everything is a bliss, and everything is beautiful, and it's amazing, then we possibly can attenuate the suffering as well. Thom calls it addicted to suffering, Thom Knoles, our teacher.

[01:05:07] Luke Storey: Great podcast, by the way, those listening, the Thom Knoles Podcast, a great Vedic meditation teacher. He does kind of short solo cast that are really amazing, incredible information on consciousness.

[01:05:18] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: And there's one chapter on it. One is dedicated to addicted to suffering, because it's like, again, it's a groove in our brain that creates through the narrative. And then, you tell your other friends, oh, I suffered so much, and you can repeat that a million times. Words carry power. Words reinstall our new pathways in the brain. You're grooving and grooving it always again, or triggers. People are saying, that triggered me. I think it's overrated because it creates other suffering.

[01:05:50] It adds to suffering. If you drop the narrative of trigger, then you say, okay, I'm just going to heal that. That's it. Because triggers imply that then whatever comes at you from the outside, you have to respond negatively, and then you feed the negative groove. But if you stop allowing yourself to be triggered, you become the actor, you're really not a reactor. You become consciously, actively involved, so nobody can trigger you, because you're above it all.

[01:06:22] Luke Storey: In PTSD then, how would you define it? Is it as simple as neural pathways being created by a traumatic event that remain unhealed and are still active, and then get reactivated or triggered, using the word that you used, because that original wound has not been healed? Can it be defined in such simplistic terms or is there more you could add to that?

[01:06:51] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: I think it's what we were talking about before that amygdala starts hyperactively discerning the various neurotransmitters that create this fight or flight reflex in the brain. And I think also in photovoltaic, electrophysiological and magnetic field of the body. And we end up experiencing that and locating these in memory, literally in our cell memories, and hippocampal areas, or in thalamic areas. And what happens from thalamus, center of emotion, and goes into the field of area of hippocampal memory cells. and that groove installs itself. It's almost like a broken record groove. Again, a vinyl that has been grooved wrongly and scratched. It's a scratched record.

[01:07:46] Luke Storey: I remember those.

[01:07:47] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Oh, yeah, we have them now again, though.

[01:07:49] Luke Storey: That get stuck Led Zeppelin, too [making sounds] on riff over and over again.

[01:07:55] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Oh, yeah. I love Led Zeppelin. That's definitely a good band.

[01:08:00] Luke Storey: One of the first five bands I think I heard on vinyl when I was a kid.

[01:08:04] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Yeah. And then, you listen to that LP is so much that it grooves the wrong way.

[01:08:09] Luke Storey: Yeah, or you'd be stoned and you'd spill the bong on it or something, or someone just scratched it.

[01:08:13] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: And it's all scratches.

[01:08:14] Luke Storey: Yeah. And there you go. But it's a great analogy for that, that thought loop some of us are familiar with, where we're like, God, I want to stop thinking about this problem.

[01:08:22] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: And that you allow the trigger to come in, and say, oh, that triggered me. So, this creates yet another little groove and you allow it. So, what would happen if you don't allow it, if you just stop reacting to these so-called triggers? And I'm not minimizing trauma, the brain trauma, post-traumatic stress disorder or complex post-traumatic stress disorder is horrifying. We all live through it. I mean, I did, you did, with many, the whole world is living through it now. And that's partially what gives me joy, too., one of the biggest joys now is heal people through Think that actually takes away the trauma, takes away post-traumatic syndrome.

[01:09:03] Luke Storey: Well, this is what I want to get to, is, I mean, I'm cautious any time an inventor, scientist, anyone, supplement maker, biohacker, or whatever, is like, oh, I know how to fix that, and then it's gone. I'm like, yeah, okay, come on, let me see it. But when I've spoken to you, because we've talked to a number of times about this, about PTSD specifically, and the technology, Think Interfaces, that you've created, you're just like, without any hesitation, say, oh, yeah, we can get rid of PTSD, and then it's just gone. Not like, oh, you feel better for a week, but you literally don't have it anymore. So, tell us a bit about that. I mean, it's a bold claim. I don't disbelieve it, especially after having three days of experience, where I'm going, huh, I feel very different, and Alyson, same thing.

[01:09:51] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: So, first of all, disclaimer, I don't have a medical study on PTSD. I only have what we call a pilot studies, because we gathered data from people who we trained. We don't do anything with that data, but we have it in our computers, so we can analyze them. But what we have gathered is facts, and then also collaboration with various other medical doctors or therapists that we spoke with, from people who had like cranial trauma, TBI.

[01:10:24] And so, you get concussion, but you have also complex PTSD that comes after that, and it's there, and it doesn't go away. So, we've seen children and adults, many, probably around 80, and that they have been in touch with their medical doctors and their hospitals, where they get their CAT scans and everything done. And so, they come to us and they train with us. And even after the first session or second session, that fog in the brain and all those complex PTSD elements that are symptoms are gone.

[01:11:00] The majority of people's sense of vision comes back, a sense of centeredness, sense of zest for life, and the capacity to read a chapter without headaches, all of that comes back and the hurt doesn't come back. So, the symptoms of PTSD don't come back. And we know that, because we've seen people from three years ago, and from three months ago, and all of them reported that I check on my clients. And so, my colleagues, and we know that, and in some occasions, yes, some people who have had very complex, difficult PTSD, they may need to have a refresher. But generally, a lot of people don't.

[01:11:44] Luke Storey: And you're talking about five to 10 45-minute sessions.

[01:11:49] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Right. Yeah. So, that's because it's quantum field, I think. And again, we have only one large study now that we have done with ADHD children who had anxiety as well in spite of the comorbidity and who had some other issues, learning issues. And we have documented data and we just send it to Nature for publication. So, we were vetted externally and internally by about 50 professionals who actually published our paper and gave us inputs.

[01:12:21] And now, it was a study that was about six years in the making. And then, all the analysis of data took a long time. So, we got the data back, and even CAT scans and MRIs, and fMRIs, which we did, and EEG signals, and then scholastic test, 68 neuropsychological tests. I mean, it's a very copious study on 64 subjects of all 43 and ADHD, placebo and the experimental study group, whereas placebo group shows no improvements or no differences in anything.

[01:12:59] Luke Storey: Really? Not even like a little bump from the placebo effect?

[01:13:03] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: So, in some aspects of the training, where placebo group still was looking at the screen, we see some improvements in like decreased anxiety from behavioral, we call it behavioral, just looking at a screen, but it's not correlated with reinforcement, everything else. But it doesn't do harm to the brain. It was just passive watching of the screen, but it already helps. So, behaviorally, we know it already helps.

[01:13:32] Luke Storey: And the placebo controlled group of people, they don't know what they're even watching. They're just watching a screen.

[01:13:39] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: No. They all had headsets on. It was very well-done study. And so, in experimental group, we see changes in EEG. We see totally different brain maps, which I'll share with you. I'll show you. Completely different brain maps, especially in the areas of executive functioning, prefrontal lobe, and even in the white matter, the area of like area for memory, hippocampal area, nucleus caudatus, and some other specific areas get activated, and what we were also surprised by, it was this area which we call insula.

[01:14:18] It's in a specific part of the brain, very small area, which is this activation of insula is connected to empathy, when people start feeling more empathy for others. And this also corresponds to our anecdotal reports, but our clients say that they feel more aware and alert, and feel more empathetic to their family members or their coworkers. And we see that on brain maps, only in experimental group and not in the placebo group.

[01:14:51] Luke Storey: Wow. And would you explain for people—because we're kind of starting to talk about the Think Interface technology now, and I think it might be a bit ambiguous to people still. So, my subjective experience of it is I come to see you, I don't tell you about any of my problems or anything, you're just like, sit in this chair, I put on a little headset that has these kind of electrodes.

[01:15:16] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: It just goes like this, goes all over your hair. We're actually the only ones who can do it all over the hair.

[01:15:21] Luke Storey: Very much like this headset, without the headphones and stuff, but kind of like a little apparatus that you kind of barely notice is there. And then, you sit in front of a computer screen, and looks like a very primitive video game, there's just kind of a little car, and then there's a cursor where your mouse is placed, and I was instructed to just follow the cursor, just like in a calm, but focused way.

[01:15:44] Just keep my attention on that cursor and do my best to not allow outside dialog to enter into my awareness, and just stay focused, and then just do that for about 45 minutes. Each time I do it, it's maybe two minutes, or five minutes, or whatever it is. It's hard to actually tell, because you're kind of out of time, but then you'll come over and you'll start it over, and then I start a new screen and kind of do it again. And 45 minutes go by, and I feel really good, the first day, I noticed what was really, actually interesting, because nothing does this.

[01:16:15] When we sat down on the floor in your hotel room, you, I, and Alyson, you two were just far away enough for me to be a little blurry in your face, because I'm a bit, whatever it is, is it nearsighted? So, distance gets a little blurry. And I was like, oh, man. So, I remember scooting closer to you so that I could have clarity and really see your face clearly, because I kind of read lips, too, because I'm a little deaf. So, I like to see faces, and you've got a great face, and a great smile, as does Alyson.

[01:16:44] So, anyway, I'm trying to get closer to you. Then, I do the training, and afterward, I was as far away and you were both totally clear. My vision improved like that. And what's interesting about that is not only that it improved, but one of the things that makes my eyes more blurry is staring at a computer screen, especially as close as I was. I try to sit back from mine, so I don't get that kind of frozen optic nerve or whatever it is. And I was like, that's weird, because I just spent 45 minutes staring at a computer.

[01:17:11] Normally, when I pull my head out of a computer, my vision is actually worse. So, that was really interesting. But just to give people an idea of what it's like for your average person to sit down and work with Think Interfaces, like you're basically just watching passively what looks to be, as I said, kind of like a video game. So, that's my version of it, but can you explain, say, when it comes to something like ADHD or PTSD, what's actually happening when the subject sits there and calmly watches that computer screen?

[01:17:40] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Yeah. First of all, thank you for explaining it so beautifully. You have a way of really, very elegant expression through your language, which is really, very sophisticated, and yet you transmit all this. You wrapped it up in such a beautiful way that it took us probably three years to try to come up with something to explain to people how it really works, but you just did such a beautiful job. So, thank you.

[01:18:06] Luke Storey: Sure.

[01:18:07] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: I'm going to transcribe that.

[01:18:07] Luke Storey: You can have the recording.

[01:18:09] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Oh, definitely. I'll be transcribing that.

[01:18:12] Luke Storey: What someone calls you guys, and it's like, what's it like? Listen to this.

[01:18:14] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Yeah, absolutely. I'm transcribing it.

[01:18:17] Luke Storey: And it's very easy. That's the thing, too. It's not like going to therapy or somewhere like, oh, man, I got to talk about the shadow stuff today, it's going to be—like you're not thinking about your problems, you're not thinking about your PTSD.

[01:18:30] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: You have to not to think.

[01:18:31] Luke Storey: Yeah, it's funny, it's called Think Interfaces, because when you're actually going through the process, the goal is to not think, and it's actually very easy. I noticed like on a good meditation day, there are very few thoughts, right? And you can really stay in that zero point. Then, some days or some times of day, your mind will be more active, right?

[01:18:49] And through Vedic meditation, as you know, you just kind of learn to let the thoughts go, et cetera. You focus on the mantra. Well, in this case, the mantra is that cursor, and I noticed like, wow, I'm focusing for a really long period of time with no thought intrusion at all, so much so that when a thought did come, I was like, oh, there is a thought, which is pretty incredible, like the degree of presence that I experienced while I'm on the-

[01:19:11] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: So, there is a lot of other people's science that came into that. So, before I actually designed the stimuli, the game, so for years, my specialty was stimulation of the retina and measuring the visual spatial frequency. It can be checkerboards, bars, and movement of that, and different temporal sequence. It can be one per second, one for every 20 seconds, 10 seconds, one for every half a second.

[01:19:43] There are different responses that the brain, that the retina, and the optical nerve will actually have, depending on the visual spatial frequency and the temporal frequency in combination with visual spatial. So, I studied that in response to dopaminergic transmission for many years at Mount Sinai Hospital, and in Rome, at San Camilo. So, that was my specialty for many years. L-dopa carbidopa response to visual simulations, and brain mapping, and evoked potentials.

[01:20:12] Luke Storey: Really quick. Don't lose that thought, but I want to ask you something. You know the herb, mucuna?

[01:20:17] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Yeah. 

[01:20:17] Luke Storey: I think it's a legume, like a bean or something. And they say that it has L-dopa, the precursor to dopamine. Is there any truth to that? Like would one have an easier time producing more dopamine if they're taking that?

[01:20:29] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: I only had two friends who had almost schizophrenic episodes, because they took too much of mucuna.

[01:20:37] Luke Storey: Oh, okay.

[01:20:38] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: And so, there is something to it, which is that I think as everything else, you have to know how to dose it. And that's why Think goes well, I'll explain what we did with Think to not overdose.

[01:20:50] Luke Storey: Okay. Sorry to interrupt. 

[01:20:52] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: No, but that is such a pertinent question. It's so brilliant. Your mind is just amazing. So fascinating to me. So, essentially, I studied about 1,300 papers that had to do with dopamine production, and various stimulation, various interstimulus intervals, I mean, we're talking about all the technological and technical language that electrophysiologists or neurobehavioralists study in order to understand how does the wired transmission, actually, in the brain goes, which then produces thoughts or produces results one way or another.

[01:21:33] It can be impacting memory. It can be impacting your movement. It can be impacting your vision, for example, like what happens to you and to many. And the reason for that is because there are dopaminergic receptors in the retina. So, you actually stimulate a lot of dopamine, and dopamine would produce, then better vision. So, what happened with that? I studied something like 1,300 studies, and I created a very large Excel spreadsheet, and I took all the elements that I wanted to have, like we want it to be non-invasive.

[01:22:09] We want it to be non-producing negative effects. So, without negative effects, we want it to have a certain amount of regulation of the equalization of nervous vagus activity bilaterally in both hemispheres. Because nervous vagus is a tenth cranial nerve with double nerve, so you have to activate it equally. There are certain sets of parameters, about 25, that we wanted, and then we will log what these studies showed. So, it was basically huge spreadsheet of 1,300 data points.

[01:22:48] Luke Storey: Oh, my God, my worst nightmare, big Excel files.

[01:22:52] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Right, totally. Mine, too. And I did not do it alone, believe me. So, what we found, we found common denominators. Where was the safe? Where was the efficient? Where was the proper modality to go for? So, that's where it's not neurofeedback, because the neurofeedback you get, whatever game you do, and here, we have frequencies of photovoltaic energy, we have frequencies of sound, we have frequencies of space, temporal frequencies. We have gazillion, like hundreds of different modalities that we combined into visible and non-visible, audible and non-audible.

[01:23:31] Luke Storey: You mean in terms of the biofeedback part of it, like what the brain of the user is experiencing?

[01:23:36] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: So, brain responds with your frequencies of EEG frequencies and also some electromagnetic frequencies. And we then pick up these sensors that are very sensitive, and they pick up in real time, feed it into the computer in real time, you co-create the game with the computer as you go along.

[01:23:56] Luke Storey: So, this is when I'm going over the jumps, you'll be like, raise the jump, Luke, with your mind, raise the jump. Some Jedi shit right there, by the way.

[01:24:04] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: That's basically the prototypical telekinesis, but these tools, we call them conscious neurotechnology, because it has an element of consciousness in it, just like the universe is conscious. These apparati that we create have elements of consciousness in them. So, that's why we're breaking the barrier, because you'll notice that it responds to your frequency of wavelengths of your brain. And it's not simple, it looks very simple, and my challenge was, and this is when I first proposed this to my group, one of my teams, they all thought I was crazy, because they said, well, how can you do that?

[01:24:46] This is very heavy, very difficult to—not only do you want to create an EEG BCI brain computer interface, but also, you want to create these games that can be easily played by a smart three-year-old or demented 88-year-old and always have a good desired effect. And I'm like, yeah, that's what I want. I want something very simple, but we wanted to get to the point where we can create something that would not be one-size-fits-all, but it would be self-tailoring to your own brain. So, that's where it's non-invasive. That's why it feels good to everybody, because you co-create this self-needing necessary levels of frequencies that your brain needs, because your brain is sentient.

[01:25:29] Luke Storey: This is so wild. Okay.

[01:25:30] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: It's beyond. It took us a while to get to the point where we can actually co-create that, more than 400 people.

[01:25:36] Luke Storey: I feel for you as being the one that has to explain this to people. I'm starting to get it. But I'm going to go back to neurofeedback and I want you also, when we're done, maybe to define that, because I've done a lot of that and it's benefited me. I wouldn't say that it's like fixed me or I walked away. I was like, no more PTSD, but I've definitely made a lot of improvements.

[01:25:59] But the way I look at neurofeedback, and correct me wherever I'm wrong, and then differentiate what you're doing from neurofeedback, perhaps, is, okay, I'm hooked up to an EEG and it's reading my brainwaves. And my brainwaves are changing based on the stimuli I'm watching on a screen in a similar way of kind of a primitive video game. The way I experience neurofeedback is sort of like my brain watching itself and talking to it itself.

[01:26:29] And then, my consciousness is kind of observing the phenomenon, because I'm aware there's a me in a body with a brain sitting in a chair, watching a screen, but it's kind of like the brain is interfacing with the technology, doing its own thing. And when there are rewards, and stimuli, and notifications, and signals coming from the speakers and from the screen, then that's encouraging my brain to down-regulate certain brain waves and encouraging it to up-regulate the brain waves that I want. Is that the basic idea of neurofeedback?

[01:26:59] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Perfect. That's exactly what it is.

[01:27:00] Luke Storey: Okay.

[01:27:01] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Except that they create, usually, these games with people who are not—most of the neurofeedback technology that I know of is not created with sophisticated digital design. So, the games, as you have seen, they hire groups of people who create games, but they're specialists in gaming, they're not specialists in visual spatial frequencies, or color frequencies, or sound frequencies.

[01:27:33] They don't go down into fine detail, where you can actually have subliminal input, non-subliminal input, and combination. And what are the ratios? And what are the ratios in temporal sequence? What are the ratios in audio sequence? What are the frequency ratios of visual frequency, audio frequency, and hue frequency, for example, and visual spatial frequency, and intensity? All of that combined as ratios.

[01:28:03] Luke Storey: Oh, interesting.

[01:28:04] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: It's much complex as algorithm, and I don't believe, so far to my knowledge, that I've seen many on the market than what we would call properly. They take the game, and it's usually one a second, one every second, one every 10 seconds, it's some sort of a reward. It's based on Skinnerian principle, and it's useful, but again, one of the thing is that you have to glue that or you're wet with the electrodes, and they're not very easy to put on, or they shave a part of your head and put the electrode on with the glue, or they put a cap, which is really complex again, and then, also, the game is done again in that way. So, it's almost binary.

[01:28:52] Luke Storey: Got it. That's interesting. Although subjectively, when you're doing neurofeedback training, you're basically doing something very similar. You're sitting there watching a screen and you're kind of observing that. But what you're saying is that what's going on kind of subperceptually with Think is infinitely more complex in terms of the feedback mechanism, right?

[01:29:17] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: So, it's like you can sit in the chair like this in a spacecraft or you can sit in a chair like this in a little bicycle that you pedal.

[01:29:30] Luke Storey: That's funny. I love it with your accent, too. And like I said, this is not a diss on neurofeedback. I love it. I've done a lot of it. But I also know that you got to do a lot of hours of neurofeedback for a long time to really move the needle. I mean, I did this at Biocybernaut in Sedona. It was, I think, like seven days, went in there for 12 hours a day. And it's grueling. I mean, it's not for the faint at heart, and then did a bunch at Peak Brain LA, all sorts of different training there with Dr. Andrew Hill, and I love it.

[01:30:04] But the time and money commitment is a concern. I mean, these programs are very expensive. I think it's like $15,000 now to go to Biocybernaut, and go travel, and get an Airbnb, and the whole thing. I mean, it's a rich person's game, although I'm sure there are altruistic practitioners that see kids that are less fortunate, et cetera. But I think what you're doing is interesting, because it's just so fast.

[01:30:29] And even when you told me, you're like, yeah, five sessions will accomplish this, Luke, the PTSD or just better mental performance, focus, sleep, whatever, vision, et cetera. And I'm kind of like, five? That's not going to do anything. I mean, that's what I'm thinking talking to you, I believe you, but I'm like, yeah, but I mean, it's going to take like 20 times, at least, or we got to do a six-month run. And as I said, it's really interesting after.

[01:30:53] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: It's all in precision.

[01:30:54] Luke Storey: After three days, I'm like, I feel very different. It's wild.

[01:30:57] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: And it'll stay like that, because you're running your brain, and you're creating your new neuroplasticity in your brain, but also at the level of quantum field, you're basically accessing your blueprint in your photovoltaic area that you are resetting your photovoltaic energetic field if you want to.

[01:31:20] Luke Storey: Oh, okay.

[01:31:20] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: And so, you're repairing holes, where there were holes, if there were some, or the energy, literally, the voltaic energy, electrophysiological energy is resetting itself.

[01:31:33] Luke Storey: Is there any impact on blood flow in the brain from Think Interfaces? What's happening with blood flow?

[01:31:38] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: We have the data from fMRIs and MRIs. So, the blood flow gets encouraged, and then we also have, where we accomplished one study that was very long. And so, finally, we managed to publish it and study that publication. And now, the second part will be tapping into genetics, because we'll be drawing also blood, and taking samples from the hair, and showing, and also measuring DaTscans and CAT scans, because we want to see at the level of the brain where exactly do we see the increase in activation of dopaminergic receptors? D1, D3, D5, what is really going on, and where? And so, we're going down to genetic and epigenetic studies.

[01:32:30] Luke Storey: Is that your phone vibrating? Probably because we got to go. I was watching the clock, which is my job, not yours, and I'm like, we've been 90 minutes right now, but I'm like, I honestly thought we would probably be good hour and 15 minutes, maybe hour-and-a-half, and I'm like, I have a lot more notes here.

[01:32:47] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Go, go.

[01:32:49] Luke Storey: But I'll be mindful of the time. There's so much more to gain for the audience. There's something we haven't really talked about. I guess this is if I had to choose something to cover-

[01:32:58] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: We can have another session, and we'll have part two, part three for the neuroscience symposium.

[01:33:04] Luke Storey: We will, for sure. But for those listening, something I did want to touch on was Parkinson's. I know that that was, as you mentioned earlier, a lot of your focus. And of course, it's something that's related to issues with dopamine. So, maybe if you could just break down what Parkinson's is, if we know what causes it, and how Think Interfaces has been so effective in helping people with that.

[01:33:28] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Okay. I'll be very brief, but I'll try to be. So, Parkinson's, usually, is either idiopathic or non-idiopathic, meaning that it comes through your own body, through your own genetics, supposedly, or you got it, because you got intoxicated one way or another, you had some injection of something or you were exposed to lead. You were exposed to some toxic material. You develop tremors generally. 

[01:33:53] When you have this unhealthy fluctuation of dopamine in your brain, you end up feeling, your motricity is affected. So, this is where dopamine impacts the motric nerves and motric ability. Your gait starts being different. Your movement of your diaphragm. Your voice gets attenuated. Your prosody and your speech is different, slurred usually. Even the vision gets worse. The cognitive functions get worse. And people start developing tremors as well.

[01:34:27] So, the way that you replace that or you try to heal normal neurology right now, allopathic neurology tries to heal Parkinson through giving people L-dopa, carbidopa, Sinemet or something like that. That was actually my dissertation in Rome was an L-dopa, carbidopa in idiopathic and non-idiopathic Parkinson's with visual, evoked potentials. So, that was what I was studying for like 10 years.

[01:34:54] And what happens also nowadays, Oliver Sacks and some other proposing boxing and ballroom dancing, because that coordinates your left and right part of the body, left and right part of nervous vagus. Both activations and constant motion creates, elevates the dopamine. So, people actually do better if they box, if they train with motions, physical motions, also, elation, because boxing makes you-

[01:35:29] Luke Storey: Oh, interesting. I wonder if that's why when I went and got a spec scan from Dr. Daniel Amen out California, part of his prescription for me, because he found some, he called them sleepy parts of my brain that really lacked blood flow. 

[01:35:41] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: I watched that episode.

[01:35:42] Luke Storey: Oh, you did? And he recommended two things, primarily. One, he said, don't do ayahuasca, which I ignored, but he said, you got to play ping pong all the time and do hyperbaric oxygen. And I never played ping pong once, but I did get a chamber and it helped me a lot.

[01:35:57] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Chamber, yeah, because it gives you so much oxygen. Yeah. But ping pong is also good, because it gives you a coordination of the muscle and it's immediate gratification of the ping, the pong.

[01:36:06] Luke Storey: Does it have the dopamine thing in it?

[01:36:08] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: And it stimulates the dopamine. It's a very nice way, or boxing is great, too.

[01:36:13] Luke Storey: What if you get hit in the head box and get a TBI?

[01:36:17] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: So, I think the boxing for Parkinson's is more like air boxing.

[01:36:20] Luke Storey: Shadow boxing? Yeah, like on a bag and stuff. Okay. And for those listening, I think perhaps the most noteworthy person that you might recognize the symptoms of Parkinson's would be Mike J. Fox, right?

[01:36:33] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Yeah.

[01:36:34] Luke Storey: Is that what he has?

[01:36:35] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Yeah. So, for those that are like wait, what does that look like? Have you ever had an opportunity to speak with him or his people?

[01:36:44] Yeah, the fundraisers, where we went to several of his fundraisers. And his team, he has a fabulous team of people. And one of our team members actually, I think, has received grants and has worked as an advisor for that, Jean Christophe Corvol has worked with him with the foundation.

[01:37:04] Luke Storey: Got it. And so, from what you were telling me, this is one of the biggest success stories about Think, is really substantially helping people with Parkinson's.

[01:37:16] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Yeah. Well, mostly, I think concussion, and trauma, PTSD, where it helps the most is PTSD, concussion, and ADHD. And then, Parkinson's, really helps tremendously. You've seen some of the cases yourself.

[01:37:30] Luke Storey: Yeah, your videos are really crazy. Guys, she shows me these before and after videos, like literally like the person sitting down in the chair, and they're having a lot of difficulties with their motor skills, and then they do the training, and she shows them walking, you have them on your iPhone, right? And this older man is walking and kind of little not balanced.

[01:37:52] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: He couldn't do these five, six steps, and then later on, he takes one step.

[01:37:56] Luke Storey: One session, and then he's like, ballerina, poof, walks right back. It's crazy. I love stuff like that.

[01:38:02] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: That's beautiful. It's really so rewarding. But I think that, also, I don't want to get the viewers, the audience, the wrong impression that it happens always the same with everybody, it doesn't. In Parkinson's, it's a very strange disorder. Actually, people can respond perfectly well, and some people get really better and stay better. Some people just slows down their progression of Parkinson's, and some people don't respond fully. There is at least 10% that doesn't really—they have to have it regularly.

[01:38:35] Luke Storey: Okay. Got it. But they still derive benefit from it?

[01:38:38] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Oh, definitely.

[01:38:38] Luke Storey: Okay. And what studies or research have you done with this technology, specifically around Parkinson's?

[01:38:46] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: We just have patients that we have taken, and we have seen that their tremor and cognition improves, and we have regular battery that we do, Luria-Nebraska test, and some specific soft neurological exam and gross motor exams that we take at the beginning, and we have data and videos as well. And then, we also present, oftentimes, our patients go back to our clients, go back to their neurologists, and then we communicate with neurologists.

[01:39:16] So, we have tons of data, but because it takes so much time and so much effort, I just finished this one large study on ADHD and anxiety as well, it has some anxiety data in there, too, and now, we also had two pilot studies on concussion and some other things. And so, we have the data in our computers, but we haven't analyzed it yet, but we have data for possible study that we can publish.

[01:39:43] Luke Storey: Cool. So exciting. So exciting. Because I mean, I've not known personally, I don't think, anyone with Parkinson's, but I've known by a degree of separation people whose parents have it and stuff, and it's just like, oh, man, oh, it's brutal. It's brutal, especially because these are people that were just functioning normally. And I don't know, for some reason, maybe because it's not like cancer or something like that, where you really hit the alarm and you could potentially die. But it seems as though people with Parkinson's live for very long time, but their quality of life is just so greatly diminished. It's just like, God, you've got to find a way to help these people.

[01:40:21] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: So, it's very rewarding when you see them really do well.

[01:40:23] Luke Storey: Oh, my God. I bet. I bet.

[01:40:25] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: I mean, it's just such a blissful life and blessing to be able to help people.

[01:40:31] Luke Storey: Yeah, it is. So, I know we're about out of time. I have 50 seconds-

[01:40:33] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: That was Michael, by the way.

[01:40:33] Luke Storey: He was like, where are you? Alright. I'm going to get you out of here. 

[01:40:39] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: It's 6:30.

[01:40:40] Luke Storey: Oh, God. Okay. It's totally my fault, Michael. If you're watching this Instagram Live-

[01:40:44] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: I think we're enjoying this so much.

[01:40:46] Luke Storey: No, I know it's so good, but I want to be respectful of your client's time and whatnot. I guess what I want to ask you is, okay, so I was fortunate enough to know you, and Alyson and I have been able to do the Think training with you, and I'm so grateful for that.

[01:41:00] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Gratitude and fortune is mine, too.

[01:41:01] Luke Storey: And I know you have a number of different scientists and partners that you're doing all kinds of developments with, but if someone right now wanted to experience this, I mean, do they have to seek you out, and you're the person that could do the training with them, or do you see this scaling in a way, where you're going to hire other practitioners that have the systems and things like that? What does access look like for people listening right now? And what do you see in the near future in terms of availability for this training?

[01:41:29] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Thank you for asking. Right now, it's me running clients one on one, in person for difficult situations. I also conduct virtually, the training, which is only this behavioral part, and in the quantum field, and that can also be done, but it's also 45 minutes with me. So, there is my website, thinkinterfaces.com, which you can post if you want to, and then they can just fill the form and send the email. And either my team or myself will respond, and I'll be honored and glad to help.

[01:42:07] In about two years, hopefully, we're going to have this out to the world. As you know, a system, just like you have this audio system that you can put on your head, and then you can coordinate it with your iPhone, or iPad, or your computer, that will be available to everybody at a very reasonable price. We're hoping to scale it so that we can actually really not charge a lot. And my dream would be, really, to work with people who have PTSD, the veterans, and the children, and adults who come from the dumps, especially now in the situation with the world is growing to the next level.

[01:42:48] We have these stresses and traumas from the 3D experiences that this planet has gone through and millions of children and adults who have suffered. And it would be my utmost honor, and pleasure, and goal to actually be able to finance and give this for free to people to really heal themselves through Think. And that's my goal. That's why I'm working hard on that, because I have a mission. You know this really found me, I did not find it, and I think this is why I came here, to help people now in this crisis, in this time.

[01:43:22] And I just always worked towards it. So, that's what my goal is, to scale it to the levels so that we can possibly have some ideas together as well on how to help the world. But for the moment, it's just me and a few, and then we're having possibility of also sale of a license. I think I spoke to you about including a few groups so that we can actually form a group, and then maybe these practitioners can then have that in their intimate offices, and then they can reach out at least to many more.

[01:43:58] Luke Storey: That'd be neat, because the data would multiply, right? There's so much value in that.

[01:44:04] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: The research is good, research is reaching many more people, the goal is to help people.

[01:44:08] Luke Storey: Yeah, totally. Well, thank you so much. I have one last question for you, and you can whizz through it, just whatever comes to mind first. So, you've taught me and the audience immense knowledge today. Who have been three teachers or teachings that have influenced you in your work that you might share with us?

[01:44:24] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Oh, very nice question. Well, people like yourself. So, this was a tremendous learning experience tonight, and in general. Your breadth of knowledge and the way that you come with your candid heart and sincere desire to actually better this world. That's the type of incredible, priceless experiences. But if I were to name the teachers who are really—usually, one of this is having a child. It's been a tremendous teaching experience, really learned so much and still learning through my daughter.

[01:45:05] And I always go into philosophy of life. So, the philosophy of life. And of course, I had some incredible teachers and there were a few that really taught me tremendous amounts from whom I studied. But spiritual teachers, one of them is Thom Knoles, and there are several others, [indiscernible] and some others from Himalayas that I worked with. And [indiscernible] in Rome.

[01:45:34] I mean, with Vedic meditation and Vedic world for three decades now, really seriously. And I think that there are people who are peacemakers, especially now, this world. I learned a lot indirectly through Mahatma Gandhi, and probably I'm not even naming names now, because the world is one big school. But I think for me, personally, what resonates is that everything goes through the heart and through the truth, true values of the world, especially now, where we're all unified.

[01:46:11] Luke Storey: Thank you so much.

[01:46:12] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: So, thank you.

[01:46:13] Luke Storey: Yeah. So, thinkinterfaces.com is the site?

[01:46:17] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Yes.

[01:46:17] Luke Storey: Okay. We'll put it in the show notes. Thank you so much, Lana. I'm so happy you came to Texas, like what a gift you are as a woman and a scientist. 

[01:46:28] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: You're such a shining light.

[01:46:30] Luke Storey: And just thank you so much for getting the experience of your technology. I can't wait to do more before you go. It's just like, I discover a lot of cool stuff, and some of it's fun, and interesting, and novel, but I really think you're on to something profound here.

[01:46:49] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Thank you. I still haven't shared my scientific paper and all of that. We'll have to dive into that.

[01:46:51] Luke Storey: We will. And also, on that note, if there's anything you want me to put in the show notes, we can do that, too, any other brain mapping or studies, any of the stuff you've done, we'll pack it into your show notes. So, yeah, especially for the people that are really data-driven, you can get in, and be like, I don't know, sounds kind of woo-woo. It's like you've really done a lot of hard science on this, so I think that adds a lot of value.

[01:47:13] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Brilliant thinking.

[01:47:13] Luke Storey: Yeah. Alright. Thanks so much, Lana.

[01:47:15] Dr. Lana Bach-Morrow: Thank you. Thank you so much, Luke.

‍